Living Between Two Countries (with Laurel Attanasio)
What is it like to divide your life between two countries? It sounds like the best of both worlds, but is it really?
Today we are joined by someone who does just that, Laurel Attanasio, founder of Laurel Ann, LLC a boutique travel company specializing in wellness adventures. Laurel divides her time between the US and Europe, mostly Italy but occasionally Spain and Portugal—or even further afield. She often spends as many as five months of the year abroad, leading yoga retreats and adventure travel—nice work if you can get it! But what are the downsides?
Some are obvious—missing her bed, her friends, her husband—while some are more surprising (you never take for granted being able to throw a load of laundry in the washer when you live out of a suitcase for months at a time!).
Laurel also discusses how her personality changes depending on which country she’s living and working in, in both subtle and dramatic ways. If you’ve ever dreamed about living with one foot in a different country and culture, don’t miss this episode.
Find Laurel on Instagram or at her website.
You can listen to Episode Living Between Two Countries (with Laurel Attanasio) right here, or find the episode on Apple Podcasts, Spotify, Overcast, and elsewhere.
Related Episodes:
If You Could Live Anywhere (with Melody Warnick)
Full Episode Transcript:
Katy Sewall
Hello. This is The Bittersweet Life. I’m Katy Sewall.
Tiffany Parks
I’m Tiffany Parks.
Katy Sewall
Tiffany in Rome, Katy in Seattle. And today we are joined by a very special guest. Tiffany, who are we speaking with today?
Tiffany Parks
Today we get to talk with Laurel Attanasio, who is not only a brilliant yoga teacher and not only a listener of this show and a personal friend of mine, but she’s also the owner of a boutique travel company specializing in wellness adventures. So if you like the sound of that, I think you’ll like the sound of this episode.
Katy Sewall
Yes. Thank you so much for being here.
Laurel Attanasio
Thank you guys for having me.
Katy Sewall
Where are you right now?
Laurel Attanasio
I am in Bethlehem, Pennsylvania. So, no, we’re very exotic. But it is home that is my home.
Katy Sewall
All right. And part of the reason we wanted to have you on, we were talking about what it’s like to be one of those, I don’t know if you’d label expat or not, but be one of those people that kind of straddles two cultures for a vast majority of your life. So I’m assuming then you spend half of your time in Pennsylvania, and what’s the rest of the time look like?
Laurel Attanasio
Majority of the time when I’m not here is in Italy, but then there’s other places that I go. So I was in Ecuador for a few weeks this year. I have Portugal coming up. I go to Spain often, but the majority of the time when I’m not here for long periods of time is often Italy. So I just got back from. I was there for six weeks, and right before that, I was in Sicily for two weeks before that, and I came home for a few weeks, then I went back to Italy for six, and then I go back in August for another few weeks. So it’s constant back and forth.
Tiffany Parks
It sounds wonderful, but also tiring.
Katy Sewall
Yeah, that’s what I was going to ask. What is it like to fly internationally that frequently?
Laurel Attanasio
You know, the flying isn’t. I’m very much used to that. And acclimating to the time zones isn’t as difficult during spring and summer because you have longer daylight. It’s a little bit more difficult in the fall when it’s getting dark at like, 07:00, and I’m like, oh, please, stay up till eight. Stay up till nine, you know, so that’s a little. Or not wanting to get out of bed when I’m in Europe, you know, so it’s a little bit easier when there’s more daylight, for sure.
As far as exhaustion just to travel, it gets a little difficult not sleeping in your own bed, in your own home after so many weeks, you know, and working for three, four weeks in a row and sleeping in a hotel, even though everybody always treats me so special and I always get very nice rooms and I’m treated very well, but even after, like, three, four weeks of that, I’m like, I just want my own house. And, you know, so that. That can be exhausting in itself. So.
Tiffany Parks
For sure, yeah, I can. I can totally see that. I remember when we first met, which, by the way, we met in Rome, and you and some people that you had recently been doing a retreat with for you came on one of my tours, which was super fun. It was a really great group of people, and we were chatting and I. You were telling me a little bit about what you do, and I remember I turned to you and I said, nice work if you can get it. I think. I think that’s what I said. Not to be rude, but honestly, because it’s true. It’s like, that’s. That was the first thought that I had in my mind. I was like, how do you make something like that into your job? Like, I mean, well done. But. But I do have to say, though, that thinking about it, because I am, despite the fact that I’m. I love to travel and I’m an, obviously, I moved abroad, I am deep down, a bit of a homebody. So I totally, totally get the missing your bed. I don’t know that I. As much as your lifestyle sounds so tempting and intriguing, I don’t know that I could do it. I don’t know that I could be away from home that much.
Laurel Attanasio
It gets quite difficult. I remember it was like I was on week two of this past six weeks, and I got a cold, and it was something so minor. But, you know, I called my husband and I’m like, I just miss my bed and my bathtub, you know?
Tiffany Parks
Do you have any. Do you have any strategies? Things at home, from home that you bring or things that you do or rituals that connect you with home that you can have when you’re abroad?
Laurel Attanasio
Yeah, I do. I bring pictures. I always get pictures printed up of, usually my dogs with me. So that actually does make it. It helps a lot. You know, people are like, oh, that must be so difficult. I’m like, you have no idea how helpful it is because it also brings a sense of routine, besides the routine of being in work, you know? But, like, getting up and taking him out to the bathroom and taking him for his walks and, you know, doing those things, that brings that sense of, I feel still like I’m at home, but I’ll bring pictures with me. I always unpack everything. I can’t even look at my suitcase. Like, I have to put it under the bed or find a spot to hide it, because if I see the suitcase, it just makes me feel like, okay, well, I’m traveling, and I have to feel grounded because my days are so long and so busy with so many people that I. It has to feel like home. And then I go by. So funny. Now I’m collecting all these ceramics and all these bowls and cups. It’s so funny. But when I go somewhere, I’ll go buy ceramic bowls from the area or, like, a nice mug, and then I have it in my room so that I’m not eating out of takeout. I’m not eating out of the plastic container or whatever they give you and not using just like, the hotel like stuff they’ll give me to send back to my room. So, like, try to make it feel like a little bit like I’m eating real food out of a real. On real plates. So it’s little things like that that I definitely need to do because if not, I feel so often it’s too long to not to have those things with me.
Katy Sewall
Are you always traveling to the same places?
Laurel Attanasio
So for over thinking about it, for ten years now, going on eleven, I’ve done a lot of trips in Sestre Levante, in the Italian Riviera in Liguria. So I’m there a lot. So that’s really nice because I do have friends that, that feel like they are family to me, you know, so when I leave there, I miss them, and when I arrive there, I miss my friends at home, you know, so it’s just always this push and pull of, like, I’m leaving them, you know, and then they can’t wait for me to come back. But I’m getting texts from friends at home. When are you coming home? So it’s, you know, but that helps a lot because I can go sit down in a restaurant and they’re like, I’ll come in and eat. You need to eat, you know, and I just sit down and it feels like I’m eating with family. Not, not just in a random restaurant somewhere, but there are places, you know, that my trip in Sicily, the family that owns the, I do it in a private villa, which is absolutely gorgeous. And, but the family who owns it, they’re so sweet, but, you know, they have their own things going on and it’s a little bit more remote, so I can’t go walk anywhere. So I’m kind of like, always in my, my little cottage by myself, you know, so that can be difficult. But I do go back there a lot, so it’s fun because when I do see the family throughout the day, they always want to talk to me and see how everything’s going, but we’re not hanging out, you know, when I have free time, so.
Katy Sewall
Yeah, well, and how much is it working out? Like, are you actually gone? Is it pretty much like 50 50 when you calculate it out? I know you’re going to like six weeks at a time, but, yeah, this.
Laurel Attanasio
Year I ended up being like, it will be four and a half months, so not exactly half, but still a lot, you know, and I, when I start back up in the fall, my husband and I will do two weeks in Italy. It’s so funny because I work there all the time. But we will go back for vacation, though, as well. So we’ll be there for two weeks in Komoli, and then I’ll go home for a few days, then we’ll fly to Portugal or off fly to Portugal, come home for a few days, and I’ll fly back to Sicily for a month.
Tiffany Parks
I can’t imagine. I’m sure there are good, practical reasons why you do that, but I cannot imagine flying across the world for a couple of days. Why don’t you just. I’m just. Just as someone who’s not in this. In this world, why don’t you just stay?
Laurel Attanasio
You know, I like coming home and just feeling grounded for a few days, and sometimes it’s very practical. I have the dog with me, and maybe he’s not going with me the next location, so I have to bring him. Him back.
Tiffany Parks
Okay.
Laurel Attanasio
This dog has the best life ever.
Tiffany Parks
So Zeke’s travel dog in the world.
Laurel Attanasio
He really is. But, you know, I do. I like coming home. It’s so silly unpacking my stuff, washing my own stuff in my washer. You know, a lot of times, I’m traveling, and I’m paying to get my laundry done at, like, a hotel. Every time I get laundry back, it’s €100. It’s not cheap. All these things just add up, and I’m just like, just want to go home for a few days, unpack, sleep in my own bed, then I’ll start it all back over again. I know it seems silly, but it seems to me it works.
Tiffany Parks
As of now, if it works, I mean, you got to do what works for you. I hate to fly so much that every single time I go back to the states, I always say to myself, I’m never coming back here. Not because I don’t want to be in the states, but because I don’t want to do that trip again.
Laurel Attanasio
We are very spoiled, or I am very spoiled because we live in the northeast. We have direct flights everywhere. So I’m not. I don’t have any layovers, and I’m not actually flying. I mean, it is long for most people, but. But it’s seven, 8 hours. You know, I’m there.
Tiffany Parks
That’s true. That’s true.
Laurel Attanasio
Then I’m an hour away from the airport. And we have so many options. If we have to, we can fly from JFK. We’re close to Newark. We’re close to Philly. So I also have a lot of flight options. And they are all direct, even this year, to go to Liguria, I flew to nice instead because I liked the time of arrival more than I liked the time of arrival in Milan. So, I mean, it’s like, it’s.
Tiffany Parks
That is true. You. That is. I didn’t think about that. Yeah. It’s a whole different beast when you got to get to the west.
Laurel Attanasio
Yeah.
Tiffany Parks
And you got to deal with a layover and the stress of possibly missing your flight or losing your bags or et cetera, et cetera.
Katy Sewall
Yeah. I guess you won’t be moving to Seattle anytime soon. I know you’re working when you’re over there, but since you’re spending so much time in the US and so much time in Italy, do you find that each place brings out different qualities of who you are?
Laurel Attanasio
Oh, for sure. Yeah. There’s Americano Laurel, and then there’s the Italiano Laurel, for sure. One. I mean, I am on work mode when I’m there for sure, like, because it’s all day long just, you know, going, going and constantly thinking of what can happen next. But I dress totally different here. I remember when we were talking about the differences. I mean, it is hilarious, the difference in the wardrobe. I mean, I will dress like, I will wear some of the clothes that I wear in Italy here, but to go out during the day right now it’s summer, so cut off jean shorts and a t shirt, like, and in Italy, I would never, I would put on a dress to go to a restaurant or go out during the day to even take my groups hiking. I will wear a dress and cute nikes. I would never do that.
Tiffany Parks
Hiking in a dress? Yes. Hardcore.
Laurel Attanasio
When you’re in Portofino, I mean, you’re not. I mean, I’m not many of the people in my groups will wear, like, athletic clothes, but I would never, you know, so it’s just funny, like, but here, I would never do that. So there’s things very much. I eat out, obviously, there every day because, mostly because I need to. But I think if I lived there, I would eat out a lot more here. It’s maybe once a week now. That’s also the difference in the quality of the food. I enjoy eating out in Italy a lot more than I do eating out here. And it’s funny, Katy, you were saying about sitting for so long, and I enjoy that there and I do enjoy that here, but it doesn’t seem to bother me. And I think part of that is going to Italy so much. I’ve learned to adapt to that. Like, I know I’m in it for the night. Go out to e. We’re staying.
Katy Sewall
You’re talking about how you have to wait for each course to come out. When we were talking about that in a later show. Yeah. Where sometimes I feel like, I mean, I noticed it most when we were on our Rome tour last year, where maybe it’s Katy in work mode, but I was like, I have things to do. I got places to be. Like, snack. Come on. Like, where’s the rest of the food? You know, I don’t want to be here for 2 hours. I want to, you know, eat and be done, but it just doesn’t work that way in Italy, so you have to give yourself over. So. Yeah, so clothes, food. What about, like, aspects of your personality?
Laurel Attanasio
I think I’m much more patient in Italy.
Tiffany Parks
You have to be.
Laurel Attanasio
Yeah, you have to. I actually, I’ve been thinking about it a lot in preparation for this. I’m like, okay, so what do I like? What are the pros? What are the cons? Who am I? Where they’re, who am I hearing? I think about how long I’ll stand in a train station waiting to buy the group their train tickets. And I know that I’m in it for probably anywhere from 30 minutes to an hour. And I just stand there and I’m like, this is life. And I think if I was here, especially, I live in the northeast. We are always in a hurry. If you slow us down, watch out. If I have to stand in a line anywhere and it’s taking too long, I’m like, what is going on? I’m checking my email. I’m getting frustrated. Whereas in Italy, I’m like, well, this is what happens in Italy. And I try to. I think part of that, too, is I try to help the people in my groups understand that. Like, when we sit down at a restaurant, okay, we’re going to be here for a few hours. Okay. You might not all get your food exactly at the same time. You might have to wait for them. You might have to wait another minute for your second glass of wine. Just, you know. You know. So I think it’s part of me is that I’m always trying to calm people down and help them be patient, that I’m very patient there. But you come home, and it’s like, I’m a north easterner.
Katy Sewall
So, you know, it’s interesting, though, because you went like, the reputation of Italians is not patience. You know, it’s more like, if the line’s too long. Find a way to get in the front of it. I’m not saying that’s necessarily true, but I’m saying that is the stereotype.
Laurel Attanasio
I’ve had some funny situations in the train station, specifically where, like, nona will be like, no, no, no. And she’s trying to get in a fight with another woman to get in the front of the line. And I’m just, it’s like, I’ll wait, I’ll wait.
Tiffany Parks
Having this battle, I feel like it’s. Everybody is patient at the beginning. Like, you kind of have to. Not everybody. Most people are patient in Italy because they know they have no choice. But then everybody has their, their limit, which, you know, can vary from person to person. And when people meet their limit, then you get those situations where people are cutting in line and all bets are off and throwing a fit and throwing a temper tantrum. And I. But yeah, it’s true. Because, like, if you think about the bank situations, the, I mean, I remember when I was growing up, my mom, for a period, worked at a bank. I used to go and, you know, say hi to her in the bank or whatever. And I just remember there was this clock right by the teller desks and it said, or whatever windows, and it said, if you wait more than five minutes, we’ll give you $5. That stuck in my mind for some reason, probably because I never got those $5 and I always hoped to get those $5, but I’m like, in Italy, it could never, in a bank situation. I mean, like, I’ve waited hours in a bank, I’ve waited hours in a post office, multiple hours. Like, it’s. To not even go into the whole, like, immigration system and that nightmare. And so I think, yeah, I think it just, people accept it more as a fact of life here, I think. Not that they’re happy about it, but it’s like, well, what are you going to do? Give me my number, I’ll go sit down and wait for my number to be called.
Katy Sewall
Well, there’s a difference right there. I mean, here in the United States, we expect to wait for a long time at the post office if it’s, say, Christmas time. But I mean, I can’t even tell you the last time I walked into a bank. I think, you know, if anything, you’ll do a drive through or just use the ATM. Like you never actually correspond with anybody.
Tiffany Parks
Well, even, even in Italy, it’s much less common. But sometimes you do. Sometimes you do have to talk to your banker. You’ve got a serious issue or you’ve got to open a mortgage or something. There are occasions when you have to go in, but, yes, it’s like the states, they’re keeping up technologically almost as.
Katy Sewall
Far as going back and forth as much as you do. What’s the longest you’ve ever gone for one.
Laurel Attanasio
Last year, I was gone for two months. So I was in Italy for two months because I ran, I think, five groups back to back, which was a little bit much. I don’t think I’ll do that again, but you never know. Yeah.
Katy Sewall
So, in going back and forth, do you have the time to build up the weird culture shock that sometimes when you’re in Italy for a long period of time, you come back to the US and something strikes you as particularly odd, or vice versa, you go back to Italy, something feels kind of weird compared to, because you’re kind of spanning these two cultures. So do you have things that strike you as unusual?
Laurel Attanasio
Always. Always. I mean, I think I actually see it. I acclimate. I believe I do acclimate more to Italy. And then when I come home, some things are a little bit more difficult for me. I do find. I mean, I get out, like, we get off the plane in Newark, and it is. Everyone’s like, I know, Tiffany, you say Italians are loud. I don’t know. I find. I find that Americans can be just as loud or louder or just like this, almost like everybody’s yelling at you and everyone’s in a hurry and everyone is not afraid to be rude to you. And, like, that sometimes is like a culture shock, like, the moment I get off the plane and I always try to think about, like, if this was your first time visiting our country, like, this is your first experience, like, coming into the US. So that instantly is. But I do. Even though I acclimate and come home and dress differently, sometimes I’m like, out at a restaurant and I’m like, why are they in their yoga pants? Like, at dinner? Like, it’s like, you know. You know, I start like, oh, I’m the. Now I’m the Italian. Like, watching the Americans sometimes, you know? And even as we were saying, you know, when I go to Italy, it’s like, I accept things more, for sure, you know, you’re talking about the bank, Tiffany. But my husband asked me twice to go into the pharmacy this past time because he doesn’t speak Italian, but I do. So, of course, I get the role of going inside everywhere and asking for everything and communicating all things, and I just was like, oh, at home, if I walked into a CVS, I could go pick up all the random stuff I wanted to buy. Whereas he had acid reflux, which you would think, oh, I could go get some antacids or something. No, you have to talk to the pharmacist. I had to wait in the line forever because there was a bunch of people in front of me, and I just sat there and I waited patiently. And another time, you just needed eye drops. Nope, not again. Not. Not behind. You know, I had to be. It was behind the counter, and I had to talk to them. I had to tell her what her is. I looked like and da da da da. I was like, at home, this would be so much faster. But then I also thought I’d probably buy the wrong thing if I was at home, I’d probably buy, like, 20 things just in case where there at least I got the right thing. And I told them, you know, so I think that I acclimate there much easier. And then I come home, I find myself being a little bit more critical of things here, for good or bad. I don’t know.
Katy Sewall
Why do you think that is, though? Like, why do you think you have more? Is it because Italy is ultimately the more foreign place that you are more patient on your there versus, like, when you’re at home?
Laurel Attanasio
Hmm. I think culturally, because we just aren’t patient here. So I just jump right back into that and it comes on all levels. Whereas there, I’m like, okay, this is what it is.
Katy Sewall
You know, it’s interesting, though, because it is, like, cultural. Like, if you were in the south, you know, you’d have to have infinite patience because the lines there, from my.
Laurel Attanasio
Experience, move, and I don’t acclimate well there. So that is really funny. When we go down south, I’m like, I remember many, many years ago, I said to my husband, I was like, oh, we should move to Savannah or Charleston. Oh, they’re so quaint. They’re so. This. My sister actually lives in Charleston now. I go down there and I’m like, oh, my goodness. Like, so it is really funny, because when you’re. When I’m here, it’s. I’m here.
Tiffany Parks
Mentally, I think Seattle’s got to be the happy medium, don’t you, Katie? Because I feel like that frenetic pace. I mean, and correct me if I’m wrong, because I’ve spent almost no time in Seattle in the past 20 years, but I did grow up there. I feel a big difference between the northeast and the northwest. I feel like the northeast. Yeah, it’s much more like dog eat dog. Like, go, go, go. And don’t get in my way. And I feel like in Seattle, it’s much more like, hey, how you doing? How you feeling? You know, I don’t know. They’re just people, but maybe that’s just a stereotype. I don’t know. Katie, what do you feel like when you get off the airplane? Do you get that sensation that she gets getting off the plane in New York?
Katy Sewall
No, it’s different. Yeah, Seattle’s more chill. I mean, and obviously Seattle’s changing. There’s a lot of people who have moved here in the last five years. The population is growing infinitely. But, no, there’s a sort of. I don’t know, what would it be? Lack of any kind of pomp around Seattle. It’s just very lackadaisical.
Tiffany Parks
Low key. It’s low key.
Katy Sewall
Low key, yeah. I mean, fashion is about non existent for the most part. And part of that, I think, is the. And maybe, you know, the northeast is also built differently because of this, too, but our weather is such that most people wander around wearing, like, outdoor clothing. Here you got to be ready to be rained on at any given moment. So it’s almost, like, more like the lifestyle of being outdoorsy overtakes, like, the pretense of anything else. It’s sort of odd.
Laurel Attanasio
No, I think we’re. We’re very much city people here. It’s not very outdoorsy. So I think it comes down to, like, oh, I threw this on this morning. We’re going out. My husband and I joke like that when we’re here, we dress homeless chic. We’re like, are they homeless? Were they trying to be cool? It’s like, what are they dressed like today? So it’s. But I think it’s more of, like, hurry up. We’re in a hurry. We were always in a hurry. So it’s also very interesting to observe. Now that I’m working with all these other companies, my groups primarily are from the northeast. So their behavior and what they want from a day is so different than the groups I get from Texas or the groups I get from the midwest. It is fascinating to observe, even, like, their level of who has the patience. It is really interesting to.
Tiffany Parks
So the north wet. The north-easterners are more go, go. They want to see a lot of things in a day.
Laurel Attanasio
Correct. And they don’t want to sit still. And when they have time to sit still, for the most part, it’s like, well, what are we doing next? Um, whereas my Texas people, like, it’s funny walking with that, even just the pace of the walking. My north-easterners are pretty fast, you know, like, it’s like hurrying up. Sometimes I’m like, are you even looking at what we are walking past? You know, so. But the Texas people, I’m like, oh, my goodness. How slow can we go, guys? I don’t think we’re going to make our train. Yeah. So it’s really. My midwestern are, like a happy medium. They’re never, like, rude about anything. They’re never demanding, and they’re always like, sorry, Laurel, we don’t mean to bother, but you. But can we ask you this question? Like, it’s always, like, super, super polite, like, over the top. So it’s interesting just to observe from the US, the culture in Italy, so. Or wherever we are.
Tiffany Parks
Yeah, it’s easy to forget, especially living over here in Italy. Like, it’s easy to forget how diverse people’s personalities are around the country from area to area. It’s so easy to sort of group Americans altogether. I mean, Europeans do it all the time. They’re like, oh, you know, that’s such an American thing. And. But it’s. It is a huge country. It is bigger than Europe, and clearly, there are going to be a lot of different personalities and different lifestyles going on. It’s a good reminder I should pay more attention to that myself. As a tour guide. I kind of never think about it, but now I’m going to start paying attention.
Laurel Attanasio
That’s what I was going to ask you for your groups. So for your October travel trip, which I’ll tell everybody they should go on if they’re coming to Rome.
Katy Sewall
We’re coming into a last call situation because we have to close registration on August 1, so.
Laurel Attanasio
But you have spots left?
Katy Sewall
We do have some spots left, yes.
Laurel Attanasio
Because I have my Sicily groups. I’m sure most of them will be coming through Rome. So I have had it on my mind to let them know I can.
Katy Sewall
Send it on to you. I’ll pass you the information.
Laurel Attanasio
Yes, please. So do you get people from all over, or do you feel like you get people from, like, one location more?
Katy Sewall
So, yeah, I mean, we’ve only. We only did it for the first time last year, so we can only gauge by last year’s group so far. But we probably had, at least we.
Tiffany Parks
Had a lot of Seattle people.
Katy Sewall
We had five people who were not necessarily from Seattle proper, but they were from around the Pacific Northwest. So five of the group were from around here, and everybody else was sort of scattered about like, you know, California, New York, Florida. I think we have.
Tiffany Parks
We had some expats.
Katy Sewall
Yeah, one couple came from Switzerland, but they were from the Midwest and they were very nice, but super nice. So, yeah, kind of from all over. But yeah, we did have kind of a higher percentage of Pacific Northwesterners on the first one. I don’t think that will be the case on the second, so we’ll see. But who knows? We’re not sold out yet, so we’ll find out.
Tiffany Parks
Well, I did feel like the Seattle people. Just to finish this topic. I do feel like the sea. I mean, everybody in our group was.
Katy Sewall
Great, I gotta say, for sure.
Tiffany Parks
But the Seattle people were, like, super chill. They were like, just, let’s do it, you know, whatever, you know? And, like, if things came up that were, like, not on the plan or like, this church was closed or this, they were just like, it’s okay, it’s okay.
Katy Sewall
Yeah. Well, I mean, before we run out of time, I do want to ask you two questions about living this lifestyle. The first one is, what do you think it does to your friendships? Obviously, it expands it in the sense that you have a lot of friends. You have friends in Italy, you have friends here. But I just know from my experience of moving around a lot in the last ten years, it did change the dynamics with how even often you see your friends because you’re gone so much of the time, and so you’re kind of out of the mix a lot. At least that was my experience. So what has it done to you? What is it like with your friendships?
Laurel Attanasio
It is. It’s funny, I’ve been thinking about this as well, because I listened to your stayer and goer, you know, and I was just reflecting on that because I’m often going and then staying. And part of the problem is when I do come home, Tiffany, as you’re saying, you’re a homebody. I just want to be home. People are asking us to always do things or family. And I’m like, I don’t want to leave my house. Like, I haven’t been home in six weeks. Like, I want to cook in my kitchen. I want to sit in my yard. I don’t want to go anywhere. Nothing. And so it’s a little difficult when I get home, because if people ask us to do things, I still don’t want to do it. And I’ve been away for so long, and I miss a lot. I miss graduations. I miss weddings. You know, I miss a lot of things, and that’s really hard. And then it’s hard when I go and I see my friends in Italy and then I have to leave them again. I feel like it’s constant heartbreak, you know, I’m leaving friends here and I’m leaving. The day I leave here, I’m hugging my neighbor goodbye because we walk pretty much every day together, and I’m, like, in tears. And then I get to Italy and I’m leaving my friends there, and I’m like, I’m going to miss you so much. Like, it’s this constant, you know, I. But we. I’m very, very lucky that I have friends all over the world because of this. And I know that I have homes and places I can go to, and I always have people that are willing to help me when I have a problem. And Tiffany, as you know, in Italy, like, anything can happen. You know, like, my last trips in session, Levante, we had train strike multiple days, and we were supposed to be using the train. I really try on my trips to have people acclimate to the culture. And so we take the ferries, we take the trains. I want people to feel like they’re a part of the culture, not just a tourist. So it’s like, I go to buy the train tickets and I find out there’s a strike. And then, you know, I’m asking all my friends, they’re helping me get vans and stuff to go, you know, so I’m very lucky that I have people that care about me. But it’s constant heartbreak. That’s what it feels like.
Tiffany Parks
Well, I know you had another question, Katy, but I have a question. You can go first.
Katy Sewall
No, no, go ahead.
Tiffany Parks
But I definitely have a couple. Well, one of them was just out of curiosity, how of the time you are abroad, what percentage of that time is your husband with you?
Laurel Attanasio
So we’ve learned this over the many years that I’ve been doing this, that it’s actually not good for either of us to. For him to be on my trips for most of the time because he’s also taking vacation time and I’m working. We don’t have any alone time. So what he just did on my Amalfi trip, I had some people on this trip that have been traveling with me for ten years. They know him. And it’s always the question, is Josh coming my husband, or is the dog coming? And I’m like, I do all the work, guys. You just want Josh and Z there. So he came the last few days, so that was really nice because he got to spend some time with the group. And then we had vacation afterwards.
Tiffany Parks
The last time that I saw you, which was, I think, a few months ago, you guys said that you were looking for or you had found maybe some property, a place that you wanted to buy, and you had mentioned maybe you were going to save that until your retirement. The big blaring question in my mind is, besides the fact that obviously you love your home in Pennsylvania, and obviously you have these close ties with your friends and family, if you got to be over here so much, why not just move here?
Laurel Attanasio
I think it’s a great question, Tiffany. So we actually are in the process. We are probably putting an offer in on a house this week. The problem, though, is that Italy’s big, long country, so it’s never going to be centrally located to where I need to be. So we probably will rent it out most of the year and hopefully be able to use it, but eventually we’ll retire there. I can work from anywhere when I’m not with the groups. So that’s the nice thing. You know, most of my time then is when I’m not traveling, I’m planning all these adventures, but I can do that from anywhere. So we are in the process. We hope to put an offer in this week. But, you know, talking about the difference between Italy and here, it’s the same house that we went to see when we saw you in November, in December, wherever that was. But there was a bunch of stuff that red flagged us with the agents and some stuff that we didn’t trust, and we stopped and we got a lawyer, and now we have an Italian lawyer involved. And, you know, the mortgage process is a lot different. I don’t know if you know, but, like, in the US, you get approval for a mortgage before you look at a house or go to buy a house. So you know how much you can take out and you know what the percentage is, your interest rate and all that. Where in Italy, you can’t get a mortgage until you have an accepted offer. Oh, yeah. So it’s scary. It’s a little scary because we have a meeting next week with a mortgage provider in Italy, but they can’t even give you 100% guaranteed what that would be until after the offer is accepted. And the way the contracts are written, you must keep the contract if you get a mortgage.
Katy Sewall
Whoa, that’s nuts.
Laurel Attanasio
Yeah. So we’re trying to evaluate everything.
Tiffany Parks
I’m not trying to solve your life for you, but, like, I’m just like, no, but, like, I get the home, the wanting to be at home, but if your home is there even if you have to get a five hour train or 1 hour flight?
Laurel Attanasio
Yeah, I agree. I agree with you because that’s when my husband meets me for vacation. After these trips, I would prefer to rent a house or like an apartment or something that would feel more like home. And he’s like, well, I’m on vacation. I don’t want to be running to the grocery, you know, get, getting food and stocking and doing laundry and stuff. He wants to be in a hotel. So this would be perfect because I’m like, oh, well, we have our house. We’re going to go there because that’s what I do miss. I miss having a home. I miss my friends here, and I love my house, but I would love the house there as well. So if I could be there, especially when, like, as you said, when some of these times next year I’ll have like a week between Spain and Sicily, I could just go there instead of going back to.
Tiffany Parks
Which place makes you feel more, I don’t want to use the term at home because that’s not the right term because you have a home in the states and so of course you’re going to feel more at home when you’re there. But, like, which place makes you feel the least like you’re a fish out of water?
Laurel Attanasio
I feel more at home in Italy for sure. You know, I think part of it is that being a north-easterner, being a type a, I think it calms me down. Like, it slows me down a little bit. Whereas when you’re here, it’s like you’re just constantly supercharged and almost fueling that, that energy of go, go, go, and you can’t ever stop. Whereas when I’m in Italy, I’m like, oh, well, it’s time to watch the sunset. Like, I would never stop to watch the sunset here. Like it would, I think, I don’t even know. Did it set? I don’t know. We’re probably too busy on our computers doing more work. Like, you know, and even if I was there trying to accomplish something, I would take that time. Like, it, it makes me feel like a healthier person. I feel better there, I guess.
Katy Sewall
I want to say when you said, well, when I’m here, when I’m there, I can watch the sunset, but when I’m here, you know, I wouldn’t do it, but you could do it. So how come you don’t carry through the things that you appreciate about Italy when you return home?
Laurel Attanasio
We always joke that 20 years ago when we first went to Italy, we came home and we were like, we are known locally as the people who, when they come into a restaurant, is there until the restaurant closes. Like, we sit. Like, we’ll sit all night. You know, Josh and Laurel get the. The last reservation because they’ll be here all night. So we’ve acclimated to certain things. I just think that culturally, we’re all moving around and going so fast here, I start to forget because there, you know, in Italy, it’s like you’ll. They’ll find a place to go watch the sunset. And I do bring things home, but I don’t. There’s a lot of things that. It’s hard to take the north easterner out of you when you’re in the northeast, that’s for sure.
Katy Sewall
And do you think you’re going to be able to keep this up for years, decades to come, this sort of back and forth?
Laurel Attanasio
Yeah, I don’t think so. I’m trying to scale back next year a bit, but I’m also trying to figure out ways to grow without me always being the person there. Other places, it’s not so much as an I think that I can work with certain people to teach them how to be the person on the ground. In Italy, it’s a little different because people do know me, and I think that brings a lot of fun to the group, also being able to speak to the language. I know a lot of people do speak English clearly, but sometimes it’s not always the case, especially when you’re trying to get some things done. It’s important to be able to speak the language. And I will be forever taking Italian lessons. Tiffany, I don’t know if I feel like I will never, ever, ever stop. I have been with my same teacher, Chincia, for seven years. I know she’s going to share this, so I have to say she’s the best, but I always tell her she stuck with me for life because I feel like I never can stop. There’s always something else to learn. I’m never, ever going to know everything.
Tiffany Parks
I don’t know that you’ll ever know anything or that any person who learns a second language as an adult will ever learn everything. But I promise you that if you were there, if you were to move there, I think that it would probably solidify, you would reach the next level. But, I mean, you already speak Italian, so, you know, you’re already far beyond.
Katy Sewall
The average, even me. Far beyond me. I’m the average. All right, well, we should leave it there. If people want to reach out to you and, like, learn more about the tours that you take. How should they find you?
Laurel Attanasio
They can find me at my website. They’ll have to go to your notes because nobody can spell Laurel Attanasio. But it is LaurelAttanasio.com. It’s just my name.com. so once they see that, they can find me.
Katy Sewall
All right. We will put that in the notes. And thank you so much for joining us. It was fun.
Laurel Attanasio
Thank you, ladies. So you have to come visit me once we have our house in Calabria.
Katy Sewall
Oh, yeah.
Laurel Attanasio
You have to come to the south. Absolutely.
Katy Sewall
All right. Well, we will leave it there. And until next time, this is The Bittersweet Life. I’m Katy Sewall.
Tiffany Parks
I’m Tiffany Parks.
Katy Sewall
Join us again. Bye.
